[Lisa Wagner]

I just got back from the ICE Expo in Vegas, which was great by the way. Here in the US we have some very combative competitive shows. It is "us" and "them" with some in this industry... which is weird because most of us have grown up as part of regional associations, and helping one another.

My 3 major competitors in my city, were trained by me. LOL. But we are friendly. That is just the way my family and I have always been... we would rather have people out there doing better work, than ruining rugs.

I know that is not normal in the US. Perhaps not normal anywhere. But I believe there is plenty of business, and too few good cleaners to serve those customers.

I am curious in the UK if your shows/events tend to support each other and work together, or if there is the same scarcity mindset as we have here in our industry?

Is there anyone who does training at a superior level than others? And is more welcoming and inclusive than others?

I remember a few years ago I was approached to teach a rug course where they were requiring that I must not only use their chemicals/equipment (which was reasonable) but that I must not mention anyone else's products at all (that was unreasonable). I told them I teach concepts and steps - and the tools/chemicals don't matter as much as the education of the person using them. If you can go to the grocery store and buy white vinegar to stabilize dyes in a rug wash pit affordable when you are starting out... I'm going to share that.

I turned down a big check because of that. But if the goal is to teach and share value... a manufacturer has to be confident enough about what they make to allow competitive ideas/products and not be fearful about it.

Over here many shows end up getting underwritten by manufacturers, so they sometimes become more of the goals of that company rather than the goal of educating.

Can you let me know how training is going over here, and the shows? Do you all go to multiple events, do you see each other at them? Anyone really doing the teaching and trade show side of things really well?

I hope this isn't a boring question to ask. I'm just wondering if we are alone in the way we fight in the show arena. I personally hate that about how our industry here is developing.

Thank you!
Lisa

[Buckland]

Lisa - seen some of your demos and read some of your thoughtful writing about rug cleaning - I don't think its unfair to say its an industry in the making still here although there used to be a bigger industry in terms of rug cleaning but the larger (national) rug plants seem not to have survived so well in light of cheaper rug imports (chinese/indian made?) and the Ikea effect (not just them others as well) although there is plenty of new investment/interest now with smaller companies setting up bespoke craft type rug plants on regional basis. London has several newer fine/antique rug workshops/artisanal 'ethnic' experts who deal, import, repair and clean the top end part of the market which is where most sensible businesses would want to be but probably only has significant depth of business in the capital. If you want an insight on this talk to the carpet/rugs expert at Liberty in London he is very well informed and Liberty is a great shop to visit in any case.

Some will tell you the organisation with most credibility in terms of carpet cleaning (and by implication rug cleaning) is NCCA which seems well organised and has several full time staff and a widely accepted training programme that is independent of manufacturers - there is a new kid on the block called TACCA which is lighter on its feet and tends to attract independents - it got alot of flack when it started up but has survived and is now hosting regular annual Training Days - Ive not been but it certainly has enthusiasm and some experienced industry pros on board.

The Woolsafe organisation is also well respected and bigger than many people realize. They offer training and endorse products inc. consumer products which they do test scientifically - or so tis said! There are other top-level "institute" like organisations like IICRC, ISSA (which really are international), BICSc, BCC, BIFM where B always means British and there are lots of other quangos in this multi-splintered, multi-directional industry.

There are vendor-sponsored training courses like those offered by Prochem Europe (an independent UK company with a royal warrant now - god knows why but it counts for something here!) there is the equally old-established Chemspec (mostly chems) and Hydramaster (mostly machinery) latter here is also a private company with an agency.

Other privateers who offer training (largely using their own produsts and why not) include Alltec and Ashbys (used to be tied up with PowerClean) Amtech and Cleansmart. There are also some creditable regional wholesaler/manufacturer/importers some of whom offer training like Express (I am told they no longer sponsor this forum CIU but they were sponsors at one time), Restormate, Solution, Woodbridge (now called WCS - a major importer for Mytee) and many other regional cleaning /janitorial supply companies - no doubt I have left someone major out of this list but I ma sure they will be along any minute to add their bit.

The largest commercial show in the UK is The Cleaning Show which has had a chequered history recently and was cancelled due to recession/lack of interest for several years (I believe) but is back and now based in London - probably worth a visit if you can be bothered to put up with the manufacturers' bs its probably a good way to get an overview of the commercial industry in the UK

My question to you would be why? You have a big country, huge potential nationwide to expand your business without having to come all the way over here - but I am sure you will be made welcome here when you do arrive...

[John Kelly]

One difference I have noticed with American companies as opposed to ours is that they regularly slag each other off on public forums, Youtube etc.
Not the done thing over here apart from a few minor exceptions.
Most of the good suppliers here are on friendly terms and help each other out when needed which is the sensible way to do business.

[stuart_clark]

Remember the owner of Bonnet Pro ? And how he slagged off all his competitors ! Did him a power of good ! I think not




Stuart

[Radek Jablonski]

Remember the owner of Bonnet Pro ? And how he slagged off all his competitors ! Did him a power of good ! I think not

I know one these days, is called Solutions

[Ian Gourlay]

Buckland   as far as I am aware Express Cleaning Supplies no longer sponsors this Forum Mike Boxall sold that Company many years ago to concentrate on his Cleaning Consultancy and other Ventures

Cleanitup is supported by loads of companies who pay to be put in front of Independent Cleaners   There are so many I cannot see how there could be any bias

Having only done a one day Rug Course I cannot comment on suppliers pushing their equipment.

Alltec have Run Three day Courses , So has Pierre De wet Art Of Clean who established a Rug Plant near Cambridge and although did course in UK also went to Rug Plants in US

There is a company in Surrey who has run three day courses   but have not noticed him advertise so much recently

Rug Pits and Rug Cleaning usually feature on Carpet Cleaning days I have been to

[derek west]

Hi Lisa, if your in the UK in May, why not come along to our TACCA training day, here is a video of last year, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iaS0EQjUD78

Its a great event and all the suppliers get on amazingly, really friendly atmosphere. even in the Bar afterwards.

we are moving this years to a bigger venue as we have lots more on this year.

Heres a link to the days events and trainers. More to be added soon,  You may recognise some of them. http://www.tacca.co.uk/article/tacca-2015-training-day-open-saturday-may-2nd-2015/

Need anymore info you can email me direct info@arcadiacleaners.co.uk

[Lisa Wagner]

Thank you Buckland for the VERY detailed reply, I really appreciate you taking the time. I have to figure out how to set the notifications so I know there is a reply to a thread, I'm showing my tech-failings here! =)

You asked why I'm looking at the UK, with such a large market here in the US, and I was just curious about the industry environment, and I've had some repeated requests to come out there. Training has always been something I've done when I feel I can fill a need and make an impact. I remember when I had a distributor here go through and survey every cleaner who had paid to take the IICRC rug course with him over 3 years, to see how many were actually cleaning rugs today, and only 3 were out of 150. That was what led to me creating the online course, because many of those not doing rugs had a lot of questions about the process and simply did not have the confidence after the class.

Plus, it's tough to take away time from your work and do a class and hope you will remember part of what you were exposed to.

Today the growing challenge in all markets is having cleaning invoices that are more than the cost to replace the rug. We see that here in the US every day, and there is a process to make that a win/win, and have a client be happy to pay it even when they know of that price reality.

So today's courses need to not just be technical, they need to be marketing and positioning as well. It's not an "easy $7.50 psf sale" as they advertise in the US (I don't know what they hype-y rug people are claiming you can make psm there). It also is not all about the money. You want to charge a fair price for excellent work and service, and the right market will pay that when presented the right reasons why.

I was just curious how training was being conducted today there, and again, I appreciate the insight from all of you on that. I will look into those organizations, and the links.

Thank you!
Lisa

[Ian Gourlay]

Hi Lisa

Interesting that you say of 150 who invested in a course only 3 actually doing Rug Cleaning.  I think this is the problem size of market and how to reach it economically to make a return on investment. Is it worth starting a Rug Plant etc

This applies to all add ons

[Lisa Wagner]

Hi Lisa

Interesting that you say of 150 who invested in a course only 3 actually doing Rug Cleaning.  I think this is the problem size of market and how to reach it economically to make a return on investment. Is it worth starting a Rug Plant etc

This applies to all add ons

Part of the problem is fear. There are so many corners being cut from rugs to make them cheaper, that the newer rugs are more difficult to safely clean. However, once you know how to spot them, you avert the disasters. So leaving a course where you got to see some safe rugs cleaned, does not prepare you for the weird rugs you see in real life. Not that any course will make you know everything, but a course tied to a network, or getting education and having a place like this forum where you can post rugs and get feedback BEFORE the job, can help the confidence level to get you into handling more rugs.