[AshWhite]

Hi all, I know this came up a while ago, but I'm gettin ready to take the plunge, converting my HM Boxxer 421 to LPG from petrol and I wanted to check a few things;

If I buy the kit that was mentioned previously, is my local garage likely to fit it without much hassle?

How do I connect a heater to it so that keeps van warm in the winter?

What size tank would I use? And how long roughly would this last (cleaning only, not heating)

Can I do away with the petrol system altogether?

Thanks for any replies

[PaulKing]

If I buy the kit that was mentioned previously, is my local garage likely to fit it without much hassle? 
-you can fit it yourself its dead easy three of four bolts also you need a electric solinoide for shut down.  and a switch to discount the 12v petrol fuel pump ( not needed if your doing away with petrol just discount it) You need to get the gas checked by a lpg specialist anyway.


How do I connect a heater to it so that keeps van warm in the winter?
A tee piece in the line and a two independent shut off valves to turn off machine and leave gas to heater 

What size tank would I use? And how long roughly would this last (cleaning only, not heating)
110 litres last all week and plenty  more working flat out you could use a ordinary propane cylinder to get used to it

Can I do away with the petrol system altogether?
Yes if you want to, I have working fine in this frost and last years bit frezze

Going to convert my 421 soon if you want to come and do it alongside your welcome takes about 2-3 hours 

[AshWhite]

Thanks for the reply Paul, just what I needed to know.

I still think I'll get it doneby someone else, this sort of thing is not really my strong point - and I'd rather minimise the risk of the machine being out of action for any length of time.

I would've liked to have seen you doing yours, but your a bit for away unfortunately!

Thanks again, much appreciated.

[Jim_77]

Ash I would try as hard as I could to avoid screwing around trying to use your LPG to heat the van.  Besides the obvious safety risks (things that go BOOM in the night) it'll need electrical current which will flatten whichever battery you connect it to.

If I remember right you were struggling for parking the van close enough to the house for an electric connection, weren't you?  If you absolutely have to use a fuel-fired heating system in the van I'd suspect using an eberspacher running off your van's diesel might be safer and more convenient. 

Judging by reports from those who use them, you'll still be jump starting your van off the TM battery if the eberspacher is in use for a long time (even overnight)... might be an idea to power it off the TM battery so at least you can start the van in the morning and then jump start the TM... you only need a connection between the positive terminals on each battery as they are both earthed through the van's chassis

[AshWhite]

I was under the impression that an LPG heater would not need an electrical current, just running off the gas? If that is the case, it defeats a large part of the reason for the change.

Also, as far as it going bang - I'm going to think that there's just as much chance as a living room heater with a gas tank attached of going boom (bar somebody hitting the van with considerable force) and therefore bury my head in the sand

Cheers for the reply Jim

[Jim_77]

Far as I'm aware Ash, any fuel-fired heater like that would need some way of moving the heat around, and also creating a spark

Of course you could simply light a little camping stove in the middle of your van floor and leave it overnight!

Any fuel burning system would also need exhausting outside the vehicle.  Sure I've heard it mentioned too that vans get a lot of condensation in them using eberspachers... but that might be the same with any heater, if the van is allowed to get wet inside and then closed up and heated.

Apparently eberspachers make noise too, so wouldn't be any good if it was near someone's bedroom window but doubt that's a problem if it's so far from your house you can't get electric to the van.

[John Kelly]

I think Pauls got a gas heater which is just like a tube. Only needs a spark to ignite it then just burns gas. I think its Catalytic so hasn't got a flame, bit like the Coleman Black Cat camping heater.
Heaters like the eberspacher blow hot air and therefore need electricity to operate the fan.

[Bob Allen]

Thanks for your reply paul, has anyone had their Boxer 421 converted yet

[PaulKing]

Yes i have a little heater that runs of gas kicks out 1kw which is a lot in the back of a van it gets quite warm and as the van is vented so I don't get condensation,  uses a tiny amount of gas something like 4p per night. Also the gas tank in a sealed box and is vented outside so should there be a leak it goes outside as propane falls as it heavier than air. The heater is above the tank level and mounted on checker plate and protected against anything being placed on it. works well but didn't  want petrol vapours which is basically a gas as well in the mix so we removed the petrol tank and went gas only.

As you mentioned safety my gas tank is TUV and CE approved crash tested and is mounted on a frame that also is TUV and CE approved and can survive crush damage and in the event of fire has a blow off valve to realise the pressure with-out exploding.

So a quick question what certification does your petrol tank have?, I've seen marine fuel tanks, racing fuel cells and manufacturers own in-house made tanks on all sorts of truck mounts,  nothing that wrong with any of them, just pointing out gas is sometimes more regulated than petrol and unlike petrol we use a big 110litre tank that lasts all week and is topped up weekly so we never run out, most importantly that means we don't have loose petrol cans or big jerry cans in the back of the vans which is where the real danger is, one falls over and you don't notice, maybe the tops not on tight, or the seals leaky, or your carbs leaking a little, you got vapour in your van add a heater with a thermostat with a bi-metallic strip and you have a spark as well when it make contact  ( maybe 20-30 times a night) and you just warmed up the vapour making it more volatile to paraphrase an earlier quote " I wouldn't mess with petrol get it wrong and boom"

Saying that if you have electricy where you park your van just get a 200w IP rated heater ( the things you see in football changing rooms under the benches) there about £30 and get it wired in with a external socket and plug it in when you get home even easier only take a electrician couple of hours to wire it all up for you .

[PaulKing]

Been a couple of days and no reply ? Not so fast to knock LPG now , is it because everyone else has a petrol cans rattling rounding the back of the van I know I did.

[Craigp]

Interesting Paul, what's the total cost of installing, the kit and the tank?

I did consider this a few years back but having HM do it, they was charging £650 plus VAT at the time, and when did the sums it wasn't worth it as it would of taken two years before the savings in fuel paid me that back, and  thought I would want to sell my TM by then for a upgrade, so it only would have benefited the new owner.

If it's cheap enough I may look into it again..

Craig.

[AshWhite]

I've spoken to Martin @ HM earlier today, and he said it's not something they generally recommend for the 421 because it's air cooled and runs hotter. He said they would do it, but the user needs to be aware to check valves reguarly.

[Shaun_Ashmore]

Looking back on my expenses it saves me £2k a year and that's based on when petrol was averaging £1.00 - £1.20 a litre when I had a 421 4 years ago to last years figures.

Shaun

[Craigp]

Your TM must be running more than mine I only spend about 2k per year on TM fuel.

(I fill up approx once a week at £40)



Now prices have gone up to 1.40 odd a litre I can see it's even more worth doing.