[williamx]

In Birmingham 30 years ago anyone could get in their car and be a private hire driver.

25 years ago you needed a badge and plate nothing to demanding and no checks.

15 years ago you could put a sigh above your car to show that you are a private hire driver

14 years ago that was banned

10 years ago they started doing harder plating tests

5 years ago they now do full crinimal backround checks

5 years ago no car older than 3 years are allowed to be private hire vechicles

Now a private hire driver can not pick a passenger up who has flagged it down.

Every week the emforcment officers hit the streets and try to flag a private hire driver down and they succeed every week, and every week so many drivers end up in court.

Now when the new rules come into effect you will have the enforcement period were they will go for anyone they can, so that they justify that the new law is needed.

I use to be a market trader and they were always there trying to see if you are breaking the law, at times it was a joke but we were easy targets because they knew where we would be, the same will apply to window cleaners, and when they want a crack down they will know where we are as well.

[rosskesava]

But you still get taxi's that by and large do the same thing in the same way but now the licensing laws have changed.

The analogy is not a good one but I do get your point.

Also, just how many H & S officers are there? Thousands and thousands?

Just what are they going to do? Drive round the streets untill they find a window cleaner and watch him? Then how will they compile the evidence? It's illegal to video someone for legal purposes without first telling them unless a magistrate has first authorised it based on evidence.

The H & S are very very busy people and by and large they tend to act on tip off's with smaller comapanies.

There are companies and business's where the health and safety of many are at risk by employers flouting the regs.

The self employed w/c is, I think, way down the list of priorities. Most prosecutions are after the event or accident or fatality and before the event, unless it is blatant flouting and endangering life or limb, it is usuallly advise.

I'm finished with anything WAHD and H & S. So much is posted by those who havn't a clue as to how the system works and so much is guess work based on nothing other than 'I think'.

The point I've been trying to make all along is that the self employed have always been a problem in terms of regulation for the H & S people.

Philip Hanson made the most sense.

Cheers

[williamx]

There is another aspect that many have not thought about.

What is to stop a wfp cleaner running a advertising campaign saying that the total use of ladders is now illiegal and he ( the window cleaner ) might be taken to court if any hse laws have been broken.

So if you want your windows cleaned, window cleaner must use altenative methods when possible.

It might not happen as we such friendly folk, but it might.

[Thecleanerservice]

Still no money on the table then!!

So, it took 30 years to fail to control rogue taxi drivers in Birmingham.  Move out of Birmingham then.  I could name towns I've been in, eg. London, Peterboro, Northampton etc. etc. where same rules apply; taxi drivers complying, but breaking other rules.  For a fact..declaring 150 income pw, in reality 1,000!!
Sorry, went off subject there..
Advertising campaign saying total use of ladders illegal??
Promoter of such campaign will more likely find himself in court for libel, or misrepresentation of the facts.  Besides, 2 Newsnight reports, at least 2 national paper reports..viewed by a great deal more than just windowcleaners.. A number of my clients have commented, as I'm sure yours' (note the apostrophe after the 's', indicating plural) have.  After the comment, and their opinion has been added, most have then asked me what it all means.  So most value my understanding of the issue as a better interpretation of the regs than Newsnight, newspapers or other scarey looking windowcleaners.  Why?  Because I operate my business in a responsible way and most have known that about me for nearly 20 years..Reputation goes a long way.
So calm down everybody..The new regs will not be so difficult as you imagine to comply with.
If an Inspector creeps up on me one day and momentarily catches me standing on one foot 3metres up for 21/2 minutes and takes me to court over that, then it's time to retire to the costa!!  I reckon the case would fail, and for a change the success of the appeal would resound victoriously for the small man trying to safely provide a service, complying most if not all the time, supported by a list of character witnesses.  Bring back "reason".
Of course there are 'cowboys' and 'flybynights', when it gets too difficult most of them will move on to some other scam, but most on here seem to want to be law abiding and will be.  It will all be made clearer, so what's the fuss?

NOW BACK OFF OR I'LL JUMP!!

Pj

[williamx]

Pj

On the other forum I asked a member who went to the HSE meeting to explain with a simple yes or no answer what the new rules will be regarding the use of ladders, and he stated that the use of ladders ONLY is to be outlawed, he said that the cleaner must look at an alternative whether its just a pole with a squeegee or a wfp system.

http://www.anothercleaningforum.co.uk/?board=win_clng_issues;action=display;num=1127153474

Personally I could't care less what a window cleaner uses to clean windows, I just know that for my 200 customers' ( is that plural enough for you ) it going to be wfp cleaning.

[Thecleanerservice]

"Send two and fourpence, we're going to a dance".
Ooops...Bang, bang all dead!
Message should have been passed on as, "Send reinforcements, we're going to advance".
Somebody said that somebody said...
Trouble was started when rumours were spread...

Just a rumour, ladders being outlawed!  Whatever next!  They'll be saying Australian cows farts are causing the hole in the ozone layer!

The 'plural' referred to in my previous post was not getting personal old boy, I was merely highlighting that many more than one client have commented on recent press reports.  I'm pleased you have 200 customers all benefitting from your wfp skills.  I am on the learning curve to wfp myself.  When I am up and running, I hope to high heaven that I do not need to promote the use of it by scaremainering hard working skilled men who are safely using ladders on jobs where reasonable efforts to use alternative methods proved impractical.  May your surplus water not fall to the public highway in winter and freeze as an innocent old couple are waddling by.

I thought this was a Window Cleaning Forum, not a forum for promoting a certain method and trying to make it look as though alternative safe conventional methods will be outlawed in 3 months!
This forum boasts 6,700 members.  Many using different methods, the vast majority seeking the safe way. I could care less what a windowcleaner uses to clean windows.  That is why I look at this forum, (apart from the odd moment of madness).  Whenever a thread starts separating in a derrogatory way the methods used, it has been locked by the moderators as being divisive.  I hope that continues.  United we stand....
Still no money on the table, but don't worry, I'm not a gambling man.  I don't like losing either.

It's been fun locking horns with you,

NOW BACK OFF UNLESS YOU WANNA JUMP OFF WITH ME

[williamx]

May your surplus water not fall to the public highway in winter and freeze as an innocent old couple are waddling by.

Are you mad, I go to Africa every Winter, to bloody cold here.

I also won't bet on someone misfortune.

[Thecleanerservice]

Wow what a coincidence, so do I.
Africa ain't so big, maybe we could meet up!

[AuRavelling79]

Africa ain't so big, maybe we could meet up!

Act 1  Scene 1
(Somewhere in Africa in mid-Victorian times)

STANLEY  A.K.A  The Cleaner Service ...(proferring outstretched hand): "Dr Livingstone, I presume?"
Williamx (raising pith helmet) "No... my name is "X" William X, are you with the foreign service sir?
Stanley ... "No, I'm with the cleaner service!"

And so the British Empire consolidated it's claim on Africa.......

[williamx]

Ok I meet you at Churchills Bar, Kotu.

The first Julbrew on me.

[Thecleanerservice]

Sorry mate, it's Burkino Faso or we're nowhere.

[baldeagle]

If "they" are going to ban ladders, I wonder how BT linesmen, electricity linesmen, and aerial installers, are going to get on?

Baldeagle

[Thecleanerservice]

A ladderless world is no nearer than the paperless toilet!

Only a chocolate teapot would make such a law!

Pj