[Peter Blackburn]

Anyone who dabbles in Pub, Night club or heavily soiled upholstery cleaning will more than understand the problems associated with cleaning using HWE.

The soiling is not isolated to the fabric only. The wadding, padding and foam etc is also dirty due to inadequate vacuuming and cleaning in the past.
If the upholstery is HWE'd, the soil wicks back fairly rapidly when the item dry’s and this is evident when a white terry towel is rubbed on the surface. No amount of hot water extraction cleaning will clean this upholstery

Please could some person or a manufacturer design and make available to trade a large Perspex walled enclosure with spray jets mounted in various areas within the enclosure to spray the enclosed upholstery with a mild ph solution, this would be re-circulated by a base pump. After 3/4 of an hour, the dirty solution would be drained and the upholstery would then be sprayed and soaked by recirculation pump with fresh acidic water.

At the bottom of the booth would be a filter system to clean and re-circulate the Ph natural cleaning solution. Ideally this unit would be fitted with heated blow-dryers and a dehumidifier system to dry the rinsed upholstery.
Wooden frames would need re-vanishing after the clean, structures would need to be checked and re secured if necessary after the cleaning.

Once on the market I would happily give 5-10k for one of these units.

Peter


   

[robert meldrum]

Or you could try using a dry foam cleaner with bonnet mit.

[Simon Gerrard]

Sometimes dirt builds up to such an extent that it taints the colour of the fabric. You could rotary scrub the fabric to get the best possible soil release, then extract and after that apply a shampoo with an optical brightener in it and pad it off with a Minitex, or a bonnet mit if you're feeling energetic.

Simon

[derek west]

its all ready been invented peter, its called a car wash

just stick it all on the roof of your car and away ya go.

[Vernon Purcell]

Peter you could invent it, but how many guys would buy it.

[Peter Blackburn]

Come on, hurry up and get this thing invented someone!!

Imagine a cost of £750K that a pub chain is set to pay out for the re-padding, foaming and re-upholstering of heavly soiled upholstery that cannot be cleaned with todays systems.
Before people jump in and say "we can clean it", you can't. Years of neglect and poor vacuuming mean the padding and foam is heavy in dirt and will wick back. See my original post.

Peter   

[Mike Halliday]

to try and understand this better.

are you saying if you cut the top fabric off the  seating then the foam underneath would be full of soil & dirt and no matter how much you clean the top fabric this underneath soil will come through the fabric and re soil the top.

I'm sorry but if this is what you are saying then I can't believe it. the physics of the situation makes it highly unlikely this could occur

how can the soil pass through the fabric in sufficient quantities to soil the padding, if the fabric became that massively soiled it would be impossible to sit on without transfer onto the persons clothing

and then for it to wick back after cleaning would mean the cleaning solution has passed through the fabric into the padding, but our cleaning solution should never go that deep.


but i must say I have cleaned heavily soiled pub upholstery for years.. so perhaps the situation could happen 

[Peter Sweeney]

Mike,

Imagine how many sweaty people sit on this furniture (especially in nightclubs - just think of Jason H  ). I can see the logic but Vernonl says, not many would buy it.

Pete

[Peter Blackburn]

Are you saying all the thick clouds of dust that are emmited when you bash the surface of pub upholstery is only coming from the surface fabric?
The dirt needs removing from the foam, padding and wadding as well as the fabric.  
If you only clean the surface of the fabric all this dirt will wick when drying. If you dont believe me try wiping a white terry towel on the surface when the item is almost dry.

Pete

[robert meldrum]

Well I have to admit I've been guilty of this non cleaning practice for many years but my customers have always been happy with the result and have kept coming back every year for further non cleans.

In more recent years I've mainly used a dry foam method of cleaning with good reults.

If the customer is happy with the result and you know the've had good value ..............you've done your job !

[Mike Halliday]

Pete sweat will not pass through a fabric in sufficient quantities to soil the padding, if the fabric had such a high level of sweat then it would actually transfer back on the clothing of the next person who sat down.

the reason a terry towel would show dirt is not that additional soil has wicked through the fabric but that all  the dirt hasn't been removed in the first place

how does soil wick from inside the foam? and why doesn't it not happen under normal conditions before the cleaning takes place?

 wicking occurs with carpets because the dirt comes into contact with the cleaning solution so wicks upwards during the drying process but on upholstery the dirt that is supposedly inside the foam never comes into contact with the wet solution, so how can it wick to the surface of the fabric?

[Peter Blackburn]

Mike,
Filthy upholstery that has been dampened on the surface will wick all the dirt that is in the sub-surface, be it, calaco wadding, felt, foam, sponging.

Upholstery actually sucks dust, smoke and fluid leaks further and further into the soft cushioning as people sit and raise.
If you were to put some clean white cotton over a filthy dry sponge, then spray the surface of the fabric with water, the dirt will wick and turn the cotton brown. The more you spray the cotton the worse it will get.
Cleaning only the surface fabric is not enough in most commercial cases.


Pete   

[Simon Gerrard]

Peter,

I don't understand why you are so concerned about this. At the end of the day the problem you are faced with here is one of a lack of proper maintenance of the fabric in relationship to the amount of soiling it is exposed to between cleans. In other words if the client hasn't put in place the maintenance required to keep the fabric from becoming overwhelmed by soiling to the extent that you describe, then why take on their problem. You can only do what you can do with any job that is put in front of you, but the ultimate responsibility for the state of the fabric is theirs, not yours.

Simon

[sarahbelleee]

Peter you could invent it, but how many guys would buy it.

Good advertising sells everything.

[Jim_77]

I totally agree with Simon on this one.  Our job is not only to turn up and do the job, it is to help our clients get the best out of their carpets and furnishings.

Upon finding a building full of furniture like this, my approach would be to offer them a partial remedy (i.e. clean it but it won't be 100%) and then emphasise the fact that if they re-invest in new upholstery and have it cleaned at the proper intervals they won't end up with the problem ever again.  You can influence them with price, i.e. to clean real minging upholstery would be £XX per seat but if it is done before it gets in that state it will be considerably less.

Having said that, it all comes down to cost and most club/pub owners see things like carpet & upholstery cleaning as an expense rather than an investment.  In reality most of them will just call you again when it's really dirty and pay the higher price less often.  Not a market I pursue with any vigour to be honest!

Hey ho

[Jim_77]

Oh and Peter, I'm curious... is the HWE you're talking about using portable equipment or truckmounts?

[Stu.Clem]

750k for re upholstering what?!  a sultans palace?? you lot must be in some special parallel universe to even answer this post!!  sorry to seem so inflammatory (unintentional) but this really is ridiculous.

Dont clean so deep if you dont want to drag the crap thru - pub punters sit on the fabric not the wadding! Learned this from a fellow CCsers 17 yr old son who "minitexed" a whole minging pub of upholstery to satisfactory standards by the time I had even "dreaded the thought" of extractin em all!!!

sincerely

Stu

[Shaun_Ashmore]

I can see both sides here (pun intended) I did once help rip out a pub and the upholstery foam was yellowy brown from nicotine, but if I were getting serious wick back I would force dry the fabric whilst I were cleaning to prevent it from happening.

Shaun

[Vernon Purcell]

Peter you could invent it, but how many guys would buy it.

Good advertising sells everything.

It didnt sell the light bulb, Eddison gave it away at the begining.