[williamx]

A lot has been said concerning the running of the Master Window Cleaning Federation, with quite a few of its members saying it should be disbanded and replaced.  I don' think this should happen, it should carry on and within time its committee will change and therefore its policies and maybe it will move into the 21st century.
 
What I am proposing is that a WFP Owners Club is set up with the intentions of promoting the benifits of wfp cleaning.
 
To start with how many wfp cleaners are out there? 100 or 3000 or more maybe.  I would reakon that there is at least 2000 cleaners using wfp systems across the country.  If this is the case image us going to the insurance companys and saying we have 2000 plus menbers who want window cleaning insurance and we won't ever make a claim because we fell off a ladder, what do you think their response might be?
 
We could form a directory of wfp cleaners and foreward this to every council and businesses in the uk, offering a safer altenative to ladder cleaning.
 
We could list every company who make or stock parts for wfp systems, making it easier for members to upgrade their systems.
 
If one voice is trying to be heard it can be difficult to hear them but if every voice speaks as one, then that one voice becomes a ROAR. 
 
 

[Ray Pickering]

Hiya William.

You generally start new Topic's & answer question's for people like me (who don't know a lot) with useful & constructive ideas.

But i don't think this one is very good at all!

I think it's a first step to a divide with WFP cleaners & trad cleaners.

It could possibly cause animosity with a "us & them" attitude which i thought everyone was trying to avoid.

If the Topic was headed Let's Start a Squeegee Brigade Club i would'nt join.

Anyway they are my thoughts on the subject.

Regards Ray.

[H h20]

Hi William,iv`e got to agree with Ray,i think this would cause friction,wfps are an extra tool,yes they are an alterative to ladders,but we are all still window cleaners,i have chosen to swap my ladder to wfp but i still need to use a ladder now and then,i dont think we should divide ladder users and wfp users,it is down to the individual to choose the right method for the right job,Gaz 

[Moderator David@stives]

from what i have heard there are about 20,000 systems in the uk

[daniel b]

50.000 Accordin to some

[williamx]

Ray

I am not trying to create a divide between trad and polers, but at the end of the day there are real differences between the two.

Insurance is one of the major issues, if you drive a high proformance car you pay a higher dividend than if you drive a mini metro, the same applies when you are young and inexpenrenced your premiums are higher.

One of the main factors in the insurance companys charging us over the top fees is because of the greater risk involved in our trade.

With the use of wfp this risk is lowered and I feel that our premiums should show this.

With regard to companys out there lokking for window cleaners, who are been told that to contract out to a ladder man, will involve them carrying out various risk assesments and higher premiums to their own insurance premiums, providing they can get the cover.

Even though we are all window cleaners there are real differences between how we all operate, this is not to say that one method is better than the other, I believe that all window cleaners offer their customers the best services that they can.

I have been a member of several bikers groups it dosn't mean that I'm against bicycles, I will join the H.O.Gs when I can afford one but I will still like the other machines on the road.

[rosskesava]

Hi

There maybe real differences between the two but there is one thing that is the same, we all clean windows.

I think it is important to always keep that fact right out there in front otherwise the 'us and them' syndrome will again crop up.

Also, the getting of new jobs, payment, and etc is exactly the same.

In all probability, within 10 years WFP will be the normal except for those jobs that it is impracticle for. Roughly a third of our work couldn't be done with WFP and another third is dependant on parking within reach of the property.

As for insurance, mine is roughly £18 per month or approx 50p a day. If it was halved if we used only WFP, it really isn't going to make much difference to our profits.

At the end of the day, apart from sunset, there are many more aspects exactly the same and only one real difference and that is how the window is cleaned.

My opinion is that a WFP owners club would not be a good thing. I think it would divide window cleaners.

Cheers

[Thecleanerservice]

Agreed Ross
Although the post probably is well intentioned.  Most of mine are....
I am totally trad W/c have been for 18 years, but a good mate of mine has been on at me for 2 years to get wfp.  I do want to.  Circumstances haven't permitted up till now.
Yep let's not divide.

Pj

[thewindowcleaner1]

Lets face it if the federation did a better job at representing all types of window cleaning and promoted its members and thier skills not only to the select few that know of the fed but to the public as a whole, I doubt if this post would even have appeared,

As windowcleaners we do need to raise the  public preseption of our trade whether it be trad or pole,

As windowcleaners we do need a body that will stand up for us.

As windowcleaners it would be nice if we had a body that could bring us together as a whole as william x said

If one voice is trying to be heard it can be difficult to hear them but if every voice speaks as one, then that one voice becomes a ROAR

When this forward thinking group forms I'll be one of the first to join (Even the federation if it can drag its self into the 21st century)

Alan

[24-7 S C Services]

Hi Everyone,

I joined the FED several months ago, assuming they represented all window cleaners. However, as they failed to represent the wfp industry correctly on News Night, it is obvious they don't represent the wfp.

The thing that really got me, is the Bird S**t comments. Now I have cleaned loads of this with a wfp, didn't need to scrape the windows either. Even today, I removed several of them from a conservatory including the frame.

Well I will not renew my membership.

Anyway to get back to the topic point. No there should not be a divide; however, like I have said on previous posts, we need a new organization set up that represents all window cleaners. One that will help with Insurance/ training/ risk assessments/ method statements, etc.

I would like everyone’s comments on this and if possible, email me your ideas. Let’s get the ball rolling and bring the trade into the 21st century. A window cleaner should earn £30k + year not £10k like the FED says.

Andrew

[rosskesava]

I think what you must remember about TV is that those who edit it want contraversy.

TV is about viewing figures and if they want a particular slant on things regardless of what the person said, they will edit things and often the context or what else was said is lost.

I worked on the railways and they did a fly on the wall type things years ago. It never got shown because of the threat of industrial action when we all saw how it had been edited.

I was staggered at just how they will show what they want it to be regardless of the real truth.

I think we need to forget news night. News night aka the Sun with moving pictures, promoted only the following:-

The 'us and them' between Trad v WFP. Europe v 'supposed' common sense. The old way against v new. The Master Federation of Window Cleaners v Ionics the world biggest supplier of WFP.

For a piece of editing - they loaded it just perfect as they always do.

They got the effect they wanted.

As for the Fed from how I see it and what I know. I wouldn't waste my money. I think some of the postings by Phillip Hanson ring more true than the FED ones.

It definately needs a more modern uniting organisation for sure. The above posting by 24-7 S C Services says it all and could only be a good thing.

The problem is organising it and getting it off the ground is a lot of hard work and a great deal of time. I don't have those skills or the time but I'd support it though  in anyway I could provided it didn't get into the Trad v WFP thing.

Cheers

[thewindowcleaner1]

The problem is organising it and getting it off the ground is a lot of hard work and a great deal of time. I don't have those skills or the time but I'd support it though  in anyway I could provided it didn't get into the Trad v WFP thing.

Me too

[Moderator David@stives]

i would be president or executive chairman  or just support anyway