Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Mr H on February 28, 2008, 07:50:46 am
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Special thanks go to Jon Wadeson for all his help.....
Regards
Mr H
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I'd feel safer using the SL-X this way if it could be done (far stronger) because the sections could be locked in place with the clamps too. Looks good, but surely the top pole sections would be too narrow to allow debris to pass through?
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Think this a good idea, only problem a can see, is the dimensions of the hose and pole are to small, I would use rain gutter from B&Q and a vac hose at 51mm which if you look on omnipoles website your see that they have this because they had a lot of complains of not being able to do the job
Andy
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The Super-Lite sections he is using are the larger base sections which are about 48mm diameter. I presume from the pictures that he is using 51mm vacuum hose as it is fitting over the top of a base section.
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Fantastic, that really makes this forum so nice, good ideas. Alex, are you sure you are not planning a gutter vac yourself? The only reason I can think of why you would have to those vacs on your website is for that purpose? C'mon spill the beans! ;D
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thats a good isea, cant really afford one of those poles though!
there arent many of these guitter systems in the market, look at this one,
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/GUTTER-CLEANING-MACHINE-30FT-HIGH-REACH-VACUUM-SYSTEM_W0QQitemZ300202377218QQihZ020QQcategoryZ112579QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
i dont know where he got it from but looks more like a diy thing to me, have you thought of making up a system alex? as your the allpowerful supplier, were just the pawns
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This chap is using a power pole ???
http://www.hydrovacpowerclean.co.uk/
Andy
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Fantastic, that really makes this forum so nice, good ideas. Alex, are you sure you are not planning a gutter vac yourself? The only reason I can think of why you would have to those vacs on your website is for that purpose? C'mon spill the beans! ;D
We have put the Vacuums on the net as we had to do some research for a client who wanted one as a base for a Gutter-Vacuum system, so having done this we though that we might as well start selling them! We have no plans at present to release our own Gutter-Vacuum system and having looked at the above information it would seem very easy using Super-Lite sections and an off the shelf Vacuum to make your own. Having said all of that we have not counted it out. :)
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I'd feel safer using the SL-X this way if it could be done (far stronger) because the sections could be locked in place with the clamps too. Looks good, but surely the top pole sections would be too narrow to allow debris to pass through?
As Alex has stated I only used the bottom section of an SL2. I had a 60ft SL2 and only use it aouple of times each month on a contract so straight away I already had enough base sections to do standard houses and mearly bought extra sections to reach higher as they were needed. If you already have a high enough pole then you can jut buy the base sections from Gardiners. I can not say if any other modur poles are up to the same quality and make such a good airtight fit as the SL2 as I haven't been able to try any others.
It was mearly done so that I could have a very lightweight high reach gutter vacuum for less than some of the systems out there. Its also handy to know that your getting the most out of investing in equipment if it can be used for more than 1 job. Especially jobs that other cleaners can not reach. These jobs you can charge an extra premium on and still be cheeper than scaffolding or cherry pickers. Plus for many tall houses cherry pickers can't access many areas. 1 large job I'm quoting for will take about 2 days to do but the guy has snapped my offer up of £1500 because he was quoted £4500 + vat, a week for the job to be done, and the main carpark closed for a day.
Regards
Mr H
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It is unfortunate that original ideas are pirated and for that reason we spent many thousands of pounds with patent attorneys and specialist organisations to protect our original and unique concept.
I feel I should remind everyone as I have personally done to Alex that
any copy of our system will be theft of our intelectual property and may if necesary result in legal action.
It is a shame that I have to post this but theft of my patents is no different from a bogus window cleaner knocking on your customers doors and collecting money for the work you have done.
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is it illegal to build a diy version of your guttervac using different vacs and poles just following the original concept, for personal use and not resale.
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No, why would it be illegal for retail or personal use?
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I feel I should remind everyone as I have personally done to Alex that
any copy of our system will be theft of our intelectual property and may if necesary result in legal action.
because of what glyn has posted
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Im sorry, I am confused, who are you Steve, are you from Ionic Systems? Luke
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no, im not a supplier, just wondered what the law was on these situations as im not a lawyer
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Oh, just realised what you meant!!! sillly me. I should think that for personal use it will be fine, Luke
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Glyn,
I think you need to sue a nasty American Company called Upkeeper
http://www.upkeeper.com/gutterkeeper.html
Cos they've stolen your idea ::)
Unless you've patented the whole concept of a Gutter Vacuum, I think theres little you can do! Because I don't think sourcing a Wet & Dry vacuum and sticking a long hose on the end qualifies as an original idea.
Alistair
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I though that the gutter vac was the British version of the Upkeeper ( ie thought it had been bough of the American guys )
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ALL the parts I have used are off the shelf from many suppliers. So no-one (not even someone who sells a system by the same name and that does the same job as an Australian company who was doing the same thing back in 1994) can stop you putting those parts together in a certain way and using it.
http://www.guttervac.com.au/ system
So how is your gutter vac unique in comparison to the Australian one... or the American Upkeeper?
They all just use large vacuums with long poles attached to "U" shaped end pieces.
As for Patent....
Who patented the vacuum cleaner extension pipe ....? Thats all this is. Using an off the shelf piece of modular tubing to reach a distance longer than your regular vacuum cleaner does.
Can you tell me which parts exactly are patented and in what way this DIY unit breaks that patent, so that if I legally needed to I can then adjust the parts accordingly....?
Mr H
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if you can copyright the gutter vac idea and concept then why hasnt it been done with wfp? Luke
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It is unfortunate that original ideas are pirated and for that reason we spent many thousands of pounds with patent attorneys and specialist organisations to protect our original and unique concept.
I feel I should remind everyone as I have personally done to Alex that
any copy of our system will be theft of our intelectual property and may if necesary result in legal action.
It is a shame that I have to post this but theft of my patents is no different from a bogus window cleaner knocking on your customers doors and collecting money for the work you have done.
No offense Glyn, but there are loads of different gutter vac's on the market, and have been for some time. The Omnipole one is one of the more recent additions as far as I know. Having seen pictures of the Omnipole machine,.. although I agree the principle of "vacuum sucks dirt" is the same,... nothing else is.
Your post above seems very heavy handed, and a complete over reaction,... have you perhaps been taking lessons from Ionics PR (We'll sue you if you even utter the words "reach and wash") department???
I honestly think you owe Mr H an apology!
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lol 'Vacuum sucks dirt' patent owned by Omnipole.
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lol 'Vacuum sucks dirt' patent owned by Omnipole.
Do you have the link for that GQC???
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if the vac that Glyn has patented, is a big improvement over other vacuums then he can obtain a patent on it, all vacs look similar outside, its the workings inside that counts, take alexs superlite, it looks like a pole like hundreds of others, but the makeup is what separates's it, unique from the rest, in reality a company cannot afford to chase everyone up that diys a similar product for their own private use, but if you start to sell it then its a different story, to be honest i know inventors who have had their patented inventions produce under there nose, knowing they cant take them to court because they would not win, theres a guy on here who invented the windup torch, believe it or not, you all know him, i cant say who. the company stole it from him >:(
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Joe does this mean I can build my own gutter vac without fear of being prosecuted?
And thank you Joe, You know what for ;)
I have just spent the past half hour doing a patent search and I can't find it, can anyone help??
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So Jeff, you built the wind up torch........?
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basically yes, if it is all totally different parts you can, but it can not be identical to Glyn's, i would say to patent a gutter vac, you would need to have multiple patents on it, the workings, the design, and the hose function, the safest way for anyone to protect their product is to display their patent number, this way you can view it, to make sure your not copying Glyn's gutter vac
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but joe, its a vaccum attached to a hose to a length of pipe
will "hoover" be onto dyson for using the idea of a vaccum cleaner to suck up dirt
i cannot see it really and as its been said above, just looks like glyn is trying to " flex some muscle" and scare a few on a forum into not building a gutter vaccum cleaner :( a bit sad really
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In My workshop I have a wet'n'dry' vacuum and it came supplied with a 20' long hose, to allow me to attach it to different tools in the workshop, has this German company broken any laws, I very much doubt it.
So I can't stick it on a pole and suck the crap from any gutters ::)
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matt, dysons was unique, he invented the bagless vac, you see where i am coming from, to get a patent it must funtion difrently from the others, to get a real patent now, it must be new, not be common knowlege to the ordinary punter ;D
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I Just looked on Glyns site and the patent is still pending, I can also see why glyn may haved jumped in, the bracket that is shown on the DIY version looks very similar to Glyns.
http://www.omnipole.com/OmniVac%20and%20OmniCam.htm scroll down and enlarge the view.
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I of course would not be jumping on this if others had been using the system for years and then I had simply copied them and adapted the system and then applied for patents.
I invented the concept of cleaning gutters using a vacuum system in 2001 and am protected within the EC with this regard, I am also protected by filed patents on several of the componants If I was foolish enouth to divulge what the protection covered I would be nulifying the applications.
Ionics system is completly different to our system firstly being engine powered, and imported from the USA
I cannot understand why some on this forum complain when a new window cleaner to your area somehow gets a job from you but you cannot see that copying the concept of my system is the exactly same.
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whats the patent number? I'm interested to know
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Glyn I'm a bit dumb here, are you saying no one can make a gutter vac of there own and use it for there business, I have a mate who's been useing his for years and I want to build my own, so can I or not???
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the only part i see that is very similar to glyns is the pic in the diy insructions in the pic, the bent hose with the adjustable clamps, then fair play glyn, i cant image your refering to anyone buying a strong vac from another manufacturer, and adding their own pole to make a diy system, its to common knowlege to get a patent,
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Jeff
What I am saying is it is certainly unethical and maybe illegal (which I will now need to check on) to give details of how to deprive me and my staff of a living for which I paid the legal system handsomly to protect.
I cannot see how it would be any different if I was to get details of some members rounds and how much they charged each customer and post it on forums encoraging others to canvess their work.
Perhaps someone could explain why this would be wrong but pirating my equipment is fine to do because it saves some forum members a few pounds, attempting to copy my system.
Alex Gardener informed me that he had recently taken legal action to protect some of his items!
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No offense Glyn, but there are loads of different gutter vac's on the market, and have been for some time. The Omnipole one is one of the more recent additions as far as I know. Having seen pictures of the Omnipole machine,.. although I agree the principle of "vacuum sucks dirt" is the same,... nothing else is.
Your post above seems very heavy handed, and a complete over reaction,... have you perhaps been taking lessons from Ionics PR (We'll sue you if you even utter the words "reach and wash") department???
I honestly think you owe Mr H an apology!
You are obviously joking - perhaps you would be happy if a team of window cleaners came to your jobs with knowledge of your operation and undercut you - would you appoligise to them or would that somehow be different because it was you, whos living they were attempting to affect.
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Jeff
What I am saying is it is certainly unethical and maybe illegal (which I will now need to check on) to give details of how to deprive me and my staff of a living for which I paid the legal system handsomly to protect.
I cannot see how it would be any different if I was to get details of some members rounds and how much they charged each customer and post it on forums encoraging others to canvess their work.
Perhaps someone could explain why this would be wrong but pirating my equipment is fine to do because it saves some forum members a few pounds, attempting to copy my system.
Alex Gardener informed me that he had recently taken legal action to protect some of his items!
Doing a search on Google has told me, that your idea is not new and not yours, it also includes the gutter cctv.
below is the link of many I found claiming the same thing.
http://www.google.com/patents?id=IYsmAAAAEBAJ&dq=Gutter+Vacuum its been out for years.
Are you saying that a mate of mine who has used his system for years (with proof) is now breaking copyright laws.
If you are also saying that I can't build my own system from parts source' d from different out-lets, then I will lodge an appeal at the patent office and post it on all the forums and get members to also lodge an appeal to have your patent stopped.
I'm getting sick to my back teeth with the larger companies trying to monopolies our industry and stop the smaller guys trying to make a living by building a DIY System, by putting patents on products that have been available for years, and others putting copyrights on words.
By all means sell your systems I can't fault them, but trying to stop the small fish building there own,and making a living in my mind is crazy, I could understand if they were selling them.
If some one pinches my Jobs, I don't make a song and dance about it, I normally put it down to experience, done that for years and got used to it.
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Jeff
I think you find that you have posted a list of US patents.
I'm getting sick to my back teeth with the larger companies trying to monopolies our industry and stop the smaller guys trying to make a living by building a DIY System
Come up with new ideas then instead of just copying others labours.
Why should anyone spend thousands of pounds developing an idea to then have people blatently copying it.
Easy as this I wont bother thinking of any new ideas for the window cleaning industry -
so what you will probably say- but if you think back you probably wouldnt be using any trolleys, backpacks, split chargers, baffled tanks, independant power supplies, Vikan brushes, and the GutterVac all of which we invented or developed years before the competition.
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Jeff
I think you find that you have posted a list of US patents.
I'm getting sick to my back teeth with the larger companies trying to monopolies our industry and stop the smaller guys trying to make a living by building a DIY System
Come up with new ideas then instead of just copying others labours.
Why should anyone spend thousands of pounds developing an idea to then have people blatently copying it.
Easy as this I wont bother thinking of any new ideas for the window cleaning industry -
so what you will probably say- but if you think back you probably wouldnt be using any trolleys, backpacks, split chargers, baffled tanks, independant power supplies, Vikan brushes, and the GutterVac all of which we invented or developed years before the competition.
Your right it is a US link, I was refering to the idea of the gutter vac and not the country.
How can a VAC with a longer hose be a new idea, they have been out for years, your idea of sticking it on a pole is not new and not yours and yet you are trying to patent it here in the UK? Same as the cctv system idea, I was useing that over 15 years ago so thats not new, I even have photo's of me useing a cctv on a pole that are 15 years old, they may not have been as small as they are today, but were talking ideas here and not inventions.
All your above list is true they have all been out for years, and they are only idea's adapted for our industry not new inventions.
If it was a new invention then yes by all means copyright & protect it, I have already come up with my own idea for the hook of the guttering and one that is much more stable than the one you have and able to take a variity of adaptors. I've been comeing up with idea's for years.
I wonder how long it will be before someone copyrights window cleaning and stops us all doing it.
You still haven't answered the questions on people building there own systems and people who have used this idea for years, if you want the proof I would be happy to get it for you.
I would be happy to continue this via email rather than an open forum if you wish?
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Easy as this I wont bother thinking of any new ideas for the window cleaning industry -
so what you will probably say- but if you think back you probably wouldnt be using any trolleys, backpacks, split chargers, baffled tanks, independant power supplies, Vikan brushes, and the GutterVac all of which we invented or developed years before the competition.
lol you didnt invent no trolley! you copied it, somebody sent me a link to it ages ago. some gardening thing it was.
"Independent power supplies" LOL so are you the inventor of the BATTERY then. Lol we are in the presence of greatness.
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the think is, if you diy a guttervac, then who are we infringing glyn, your provision patent, or the inventor in the usa, you need seperate patents for both countrys, now it can get realy complicated, i dont condone anyone to steal other folks inventions, but seriously you can not tell anyone they cant buy a powerful vac which already has a length of flexible hose, then add whatever pole or pipe, to make there own system, so long as they dont copy any of your ideas, that i agree with you, and glyn, did you know, the large majority of wfp ideas where taken from these very forums, ;D
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right am on strike, am going back to ladders, do it the old fashioned way ;D night folks
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Now I have looked at what is on offer :- Heres the prices you can buy the vac equipment described above from us
Standard ISSA 515M 1 x1200 watt motor 38mm outlet £195.00
Standard ISSA 640M 3 x1200 watt motors 38mm outlet £457.00
10metres 38mm black hose our price £39.00 List price £ £55.40
+ VAT
The hose is not the same type as used on our guttervac machine nor is it the same bore but is identical to the type described above and for sale by others . The vac priced above is the standard machine not our guttervac machine, however once again it is identical to the machine described above and for sale by others.
Hope this helps
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Another supplier savaged in a forum bloodbath for trying to protect his income/round :'(
Having had a couple of my original ideas nicked by "suppliers" ??? I do understand. Our next one will have patent protection but like Dyson, will I go bust paying the legal costs.
Window cleaners must be the most inventive problem solvers on the Planet and the hardest sell. I am proud to be one. Paticulary with the group intelligence that forums provide.
Good place to sell but bad place to be butchered.
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http://www.guttervac.com.au/guttervac/about.html
Unique ideas are sometimes developed from everyday situations which require solutions. The Managing Director of Gutter-Vac, Warren Ballantyne, worked for many years in the plumbing industry and was constantly being asked to clean gutters at schools and other premises. Quite often he had to place his hands in gutters to retrieve objects and rubbish. He was determined to find a faster and safer way of removing gutter debris. In 1994 Warren hit on an idea to quickly and safely clean gutters and so, Gutter- Vac was born.
The first "Gutter-Vac" was created in Bundaberg in 1994. The first five years of its operation were devoted to developing superior systems, procedures and marketing strategies. The initial market response to the Gutter-Vac service was overwhelming. It was due to this enthusiastic market reaction that Warren decided to franchise the Gutter-Vac system and all of its procedures.
Gutter-Vac sold its first franchise on the Sunshine Coast in 2000. Gutter-Vac is now Australia-wide and has over 25 franchises.
Does the name sound familiar Glyn....... Now who's copying...!!!!!
No-one can stop you from makeing your own gutter vacuum from off the shelf parts just like ford cant stop you from making a car from off the shelf parts. Even if you bought all the parts for a Ford fiesta and put it together then you could not sell it as a fiesta as ford had not made it. If Glyn has patented parts then provided they are not copied and sold then no-one is breaking any law.
If I posted that you needed exactly 18" or something of 8mm threaded rod and 20ft of a specific type of ducting or specifics like that, then I might be on slightly dodgey ground.
Trolleys are an example of what I mean. Many people have put together their own and posted details of it and how to do it so I don't see why Glyn is getting so uptight over it...
His Gutter vacuum NOR his high level camera are not new ideas.
Dread to think what he'll say when I post details of how to make a camera sytem to fit on top of your pole so you can survey "CHIMNEYS" for customers....
(Thought I'd better play safe there and not mention gutters)
Regards
Mr H
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Glyn, really you are creating a bad name for yourself on here.
Your going crazy, because somebody hooks up a wet and dry vac, to a pole and uses a hose to suck up the dirt. That has got nothing to do with your patent. Everyone can do that. It's like saying to all the other companies that they can't sell wfp. Or to a company that builds vacs that they can't use a metal tube, or any attachment, like carpet cleaning attachment, just because they look slightly similar. Ridiculous. The only thing that looks similar is the bracket that hold the pole and hose. But everyone can make something similar.
In fact, I'm going to make my own version of it aswell. Save some money aswell. Don't need it to say Omnipole in big letters.
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Patenting an idea or concept is not possible. If a long reach Vacuum attachment is used to clean Gutters then this concept is not able to be protected.
It is possible to Patent a production process or a device if it has unique features or has workings that are unique and not immediately apparent.
I would imagine that some of Glyn's vacuum attachments are unique (I have never examined them) and he has assured everyone they do have Patents Pending. Of course he is going to protect his products legally it is only what any sensible business would do. If most of us were in the same position we would do exactly the same thing. I also respect him for stating his point of view.
However the trouble with a good idea (whoever first had it, seems to be some discussion about this) is that it will be emulated, it is a fact of life. To see an example of this we have Mr Tucker and his wonderful idea-water fed pole window cleaning. If people had not copied his idea then Omnipole/Ionics/Facelift/GPS/Skypole/Eagle/Unger/Ettore/etc. would not all be making money from selling similar items. However many of the above do have slightly different approaches and some unique and protected parts to their systems.
There are also many who go down the DIY route and make their own WFP systems/poles. A private individual is free to build what he wants as long as he is not attempting to sell a product that infringes design/patent/trademark protection.
At the moment there appears to be several different Gutter-Sucking machines and apparatus available on the worlds market. They all are slightly different and have different features. As stated above we have no intention at this time in selling a Gutter-Vacuum system. We have started retailing industrial vacuums as we had been requested by clients to source them. We do have another project in hand based on these machines that has nothing to do Gutters and depending on its viability we may start marketing this. One of the reasons that we are not particularly interested ion the Gutter market is that it is far too easily replicated and put together from standard retail parts (as has been shown). Some ideas are not worth spending money protecting because with a few simple changes the idea can easily be marketed by someone else.
I wish Glyn well with his Pending Patents and for his sake I hope that they are granted. These will not however prevent the many other firms from retailing their current Gutter-Vacuum systems or from private individuals from making their own.
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Patenting an idea or concept is not possible. If a long reach Vacuum attachment is used to clean Gutters then this concept is not able to be protected.
isnt that what glyn is trying to imply here though
this is exactly why the net is great, the freedom to share info
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Easy as this I wont bother thinking of any new ideas for the window cleaning industry -
so what you will probably say- but if you think back you probably wouldnt be using any trolleys, backpacks, split chargers, baffled tanks, independant power supplies, Vikan brushes, and the GutterVac all of which we invented or developed years before the competition.
"Independent power supplies" LOL so are you the inventor of the BATTERY then. Lol we are in the presence of greatness.
;D ;D
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When Glyn posted yesterday his username was Glyn_Omnipole its now Old_Master (Guest)
Please tell me he is not sulking and taken his toys in :'(
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Yep hes gone, shame.
See ya in Windex Glyn, you do have some good toys.
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Shame, why has he gone? was he removed? I liked some of his posts, Luke
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Very interesting debate, a pity the topic couldnt be discussed instead of it only arising when someone feels they have to defend themselves.
Very good diy work Mr. H.
Glynn I wouldn't be too worried about a loss of sales, because the people who buy top of the range equipment in general are not the same ones who diy imo. There is no slur intended on either.
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When Glyn posted yesterday his username was Glyn_Omnipole its now Old_Master (Guest)
Please tell me he is not sulking and taken his toys in :'(
(http://www.teddy-bear-shop.co.uk/teddy.jpg)
glyn hang on, you forgot this
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Matt,
Cruel.............but very funny LOL ;D
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Its a shame Glyn chose to delete his membership on CIU all that was asked of him was a few simple questions and in the end he never answered them.
Most of us know about copyrights laws etc, and I for one have no intentions of breaking them, I wouldn't put reach & wash or there logo on my paperwork or vehicle, because I know its protected and this was the reasons for my questions to Glyn.
I wanted to know if I built my own DIY one would I be breaking any copyright laws? I had no intensions of copying his gutter vac, I for one know Alex isn't stupid enough to copy any-ones patent, So why warn him?
I visited Glyns web-site to see Patent pending, he was asked by another member for his patent pending registered number/s he never gave them but said he wouldn't disclose them until he was granted a patent on it, now if you have applied for a patent and its pending you can disclose it because it has already been registered.
Its a shame Glyn would not answer any ones questions directly as it would have saved a lot of replies back and forth, my main question was simple? Would I be breaking any of his copyright laws? if I built my own Gutter Vac? I asked this question 2/3 times and never once got a reply.
I had the impression that Glyn was trying to corner the market with his gutter vac and warn off any of the small fry if they tried to build there own system.
Now if you look on Glyns site all the equipment he sells, is of very good quality and no one can knock him for that, I checked all the specs on his CCTV gear and its all very good gear and worth the money he asks but you can't patent a camera on a pole, so how can you patent a gutter vac? if it has already got a patent on it, unless you make improvements to the original design.
After reading some of the replies, I came to the conclusion that Glyn may have designed some part or parts in his system and that he can patent, but he wouldn't tell us what, If he has then I hope he gets his patent.
I have the greatest respect for Glyn, as I do for every member on all the forums and my intention's and questions were honorable, if they were not then I sincerely apologies to him, they were not in any way meant to offend him, if he had answered my original post then the debate between him and myself would not have continued, I even gave Glyn the opportunity to continue the debate by email rather than an open forum.
Glyn you have my respect.
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Am I on dodgie ground?
I use an old carpet cleaning machine which when attached to a mains supply does a great job of sucking 'stuff' (choose words carefully) from gutters.
Attach suction pipe to a rigid pole and instead of sucking water from carpets it sucks 'stuff' from gutters.
Sorry but you surely can't patent a method of doing something. Where would it all end. Cars, telephone, internet, vacuum cleaners, gas supply. The list is endless of ideas which there are variations of.
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DIY a gutter vacuum system
As I am sure many of us would like to do are own DIY Gutter system and get the topic back of track
The big question is! How would you get a 51mm hose to fit into the side of entrance hole on the vacuum cleaner as it is only 38mm, would a collar / adapter work! would the big clumps of dirt course a blockage just before it goes into the vacuum 38mm hole! As it would be coming from 51mm diameter! :-\
Andy
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DIY a gutter vacuum system
As I am sure many of us would like to do are own DIY Gutter system and get the topic back of track
The big question is! How would you get a 51mm hose to fit into the side of entrance hole on the vacuum cleaner as it is only 38mm, would a collar / adapter work! would the big clumps of dirt course a blockage just before it goes into the vacuum 38mm hole! As it would be coming from 51mm diameter! :-\
Andy
The vac I have in my workshop has a 51mm outlet and the hose for sucking up water, I then have a smaller hose for my tools in the workshop, the collar of that is 51mm so fits in the vac, i suppose you could get a reducer, I think the idea is to break up any large sods ;D before you suck them up.
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Good points
Problem with a Vacuum Cleaner that has a 51mm outlet is they are not cheap! I have been looking at this (gutter vac system) for months, and your looking at a new vac with a 51mm outlet 6 or 7 hundred pounds, where 38mm ones are 2 or 3 hundred pounds, the very large clumps 1, 2 or 3 foot long i would guess you can suck and dump, I am sure Mr H could help on this!
Andy
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LOL what a hilarious thread this turned out to be,
I guess if you make ridiculous claims you have to be prepared to have them challenged.
It took me like 5 mins of sniffing around the internet to find a whole load of omnipoles "inventions"
Look here, this is the amazingly invented and patented omnitrolley LOL
Otherwise known as the mantis spray partner
http://littlewonder.com/10_spraypartner/10_01_pn_500701.pdf
Here is the omnitrolley MK2 (scroll to bottom)
Otherwise known as an Allman Sprayer
http://www.allman-sprayers.co.uk/html/turf___horticultural.html
He probably gonna tell us they copied him. LOL
Still gotta hand it to him, he's managed to be a DIY bloke, but selling it to other people LOL
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LOL what a hilarious thread this turned out to be,
I guess if you make ridiculous claims you have to be prepared to have them challenged.
It took me like 5 mins of sniffing around the internet to find a whole load of omnipoles "inventions"
Look here, this is the amazingly invented and patented omnitrolley LOL
Otherwise known as the mantis spray partner
http://littlewonder.com/10_spraypartner/10_01_pn_500701.pdf
Here is the omnitrolley MK2 (scroll to bottom)
Otherwise known as an Allman Sprayer
http://www.allman-sprayers.co.uk/html/turf___horticultural.html
He probably gonna tell us they copied him. LOL
Still gotta hand it to him, he's managed to be a DIY bloke, but selling it to other people LOL
the Mantis sprayer has been on here before, last time we had a discussion on it, it was decided as it wasnt RED then it wasnt a omnitrolley, they might have invented the colour red now :P :P who knows
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LOL what a hilarious thread this turned out to be,
I guess if you make ridiculous claims you have to be prepared to have them challenged.
It took me like 5 mins of sniffing around the internet to find a whole load of omnipoles "inventions"
Look here, this is the amazingly invented and patented omnitrolley LOL
Otherwise known as the mantis spray partner
http://littlewonder.com/10_spraypartner/10_01_pn_500701.pdf
Here is the omnitrolley MK2 (scroll to bottom)
Otherwise known as an Allman Sprayer
http://www.allman-sprayers.co.uk/html/turf___horticultural.html
He probably gonna tell us they copied him. LOL
Still gotta hand it to him, he's managed to be a DIY bloke, but selling it to other people LOL
WoW! :o :o :o
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I must say this has been an amazing bun fight ;)
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it all sucks
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it all sucks
I think thats "Patently" obvious LOL ;D
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LOL what a hilarious thread this turned out to be,
I guess if you make ridiculous claims you have to be prepared to have them challenged.
It took me like 5 mins of sniffing around the internet to find a whole load of omnipoles "inventions"
Look here, this is the amazingly invented and patented omnitrolley LOL
Otherwise known as the mantis spray partner
http://littlewonder.com/10_spraypartner/10_01_pn_500701.pdf
I think I first saw the omni trolley at the windsor Holiday Inn Fed show in 1999 built for a guy in Derby. It was Omnis own moulding. The Mantis came a couple of years later.
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Good points
Problem with a Vacuum Cleaner that has a 51mm outlet is they are not cheap! I have been looking at this (gutter vac system) for months, and your looking at a new vac with a 51mm outlet 6 or 7 hundred pounds, where 38mm ones are 2 or 3 hundred pounds, the very large clumps 1, 2 or 3 foot long i would guess you can suck and dump, I am sure Mr H could help on this!
Andy
I have used the Gutter Sucker to suck and dump a few bits of slate, tennis balls, rugby ball and a sweatshirt.
Had a couple of blockages at the point where the pe inside the vacuum has blocked due to twigs stopping the leaves. Its no big deaas you just rest the pole section against the gutter and unplug the pipe from the vacuum and pull out the twig. Not had any blockages in the tubes or the pipes other than the first useage. On that occasion I put the whole gutter end into a huge blockage in a downpipe. But as the SL2 is so light I didn't have to dismantle it to unblock it. Just tipped it down to horizontal and plled the stuff out, then straight back up again. That was at about 40ft in length.
So long as when you move along you don't shove it in to the middle of a large clump of wet leaves then your fine.
I usually "bounce" the fitting along in the gutter. Moving it a few inches at a time so as to get everything out and not to get to much going in at once.
The last time I used it I tried firstly going along the top of the gutter so hat the end was just over halfway over the gutter edge. This picked up quite a bit of light dry stuff. Then I went along the it inside the gutter and it did a good job.
The upholstery tool is great for the sections where the tiles come to far down into the gutter. I have cut some "V" shapes in to one to act as teeth or rake to break up and big bits but as yet I have only tester it on a piece of guttering in the garage with some soil packed in so have to wait till a field test to decide if it is any good.
Put a short split in the pipe and used a jubilee clip to hold it in place...
BUT... since then I have fitted one of the plastic extension pipes that comes with the vacuum to the gutter end of the pipe. That way it is easier to change tools as they just push fit on to this.
Hope that all makes sence....
Regards
Mr H
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All this Gutter Sucker stuff has convinced me more and more that all you need is some kind of rake/spike/tool of some sort to just drag along the gutter on the top of your pole to catch the biggest stuff and drag it over the side, no pressure washers and no vac cleaners required. I suppose the problem would be those clips that bridge the gutter?
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out of interest as there seems to be a few of you "vac-ers " out there , how much do you charge per meter of gutter? I have only ever done 3 or 4 cleans by hand and hated them so much i stopped offering the service....it seemed i had the pricing totally wrong and it was a filthy dangerous job!! but as it seems "quite" straight forward to diy a vac (and ionics have already had enough of my hard earned!) i might give it go if the price is right!!
cheers, greg
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I did see something a few months ago on an American site. It was like a pair of plastic salad tongs on the end of a long pole. Worked ok'ish but you can't see what you have or haven't left behind. The thing I don't like about preasure washing the debris out of a gutter is cleaning all the mess up afterwards. Whats on the ground as well as whats stuck to the walls.....
If you do come up with an idea then great.... Go for it....
Regards
Mr H
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out of interest as there seems to be a few of you "vac-ers " out there , how much do you charge per meter of gutter? I have only ever done 3 or 4 cleans by hand and hated them so much i stopped offering the service....it seemed i had the pricing totally wrong and it was a filthy dangerous job!! but as it seems "quite" straight forward to diy a vac (and ionics have already had enough of my hard earned!) i might give it go if the price is right!!
cheers, greg
Average house of average height then for each side I charge £25 for empty £25 for a clean or £35 for both empty and clean. If its a 2 storey town house then the price is upped
to £35 each and £50 for both. Then depending on the size of the house you just work out if a side is 2 or 3 times the average sort of size. If its a really aukward bit then charge a bit extra again.
Regards
Mr H
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appreciated , thanks
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I did see something a few months ago on an American site. It was like a pair of plastic salad tongs on the end of a long pole. Worked ok'ish but you can't see what you have or haven't left behind. The thing I don't like about preasure washing the debris out of a gutter is cleaning all the mess up afterwards. Whats on the ground as well as whats stuck to the walls.....
If you do come up with an idea then great.... Go for it....
Regards
Mr H
Mr H
You have it all wrong with the lance and pressure washer, if you angle the jets right, you blow all the crap into next doors garden, Hey presto no cleaning up afterwards 8) ;D ;D ;D ;D and you might even land the job of cleaning all the crap of next doors house :) ;D ;D
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I have to say at this point I am a user of Omnipoles gutter vac and Powerpole. The guttervac is a very good machine and is the only one on the market that boasts a 50mm vacuum tube, and a semi telescopic aluminum pole. Whatever one might think the fact is its an exceptional tool and has made me many £££ since I bought it. I have several very lucrative contracts just because of the machines capabilities. I also Love the Omnipole Powerpole not for wfp but for pressure washing at 36ft which is well beyond any other lances capability.
Before we knock Omnipole and Glyn Howard maybe we should think about the good he has done for our industry. I know I would buy either tool from him again without hesitation.
Another point I shall raise is that If I use a 38 mm tool on the end of my gutter vac It does block a lot and you spend your time playing suck and dump. With out this tool on and the open 50 mm attachment the machine justs eats and eats! Making the job faster. I recently did a block of three storey flats. I charge £300 as the only alternative was scaffolding. I was there for 2.5 hours.
I know nothing about copyright or patents but I do know the Omnivac is an exceptional tool.
Kev ;)
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I certainly haven't tried to knock the Omnipole.
All I did was post details of how someone can DIY a gutter vacuuming system for themselves. Just like some in the past have posted details of how to make WFP poles out of fishing poles or how to make a trolley system or even how to put together a van system for less from different suppliers.....
I'm sure its a very good pole and I look forward to one day comparing it to my DIY system and posting the findings.....
Regards
Mr H
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Before we knock Omnipole and Glyn Howard maybe we should think about the good he has done for our industry. I know I would buy either tool from him again without hesitation.
to be fair Kev, i dont think any1 is knocking glyn ( omni )
he has made some statements in this thread that were just a little OTT, the thing about trolleys, backpacks, split chargers, baffled tanks, trolleys, backpacks, split chargers, baffled tanks, independant power supplies, Vikan brushes,
the nateral progression from a big van mount system for the bigger operators and the 1 man WC'er was allways going to be a trolley, of course that would need a independant power supply ( battery ) im not sure he can claim that as his idea
split chargers have been using in the caravan . motorhome for a very long time, i belive westefila installed a 2nd power source in the 70's
oh and Jeff B been using his backpack for a fair long time, i dont know if its longer than glyn has been usnign / selling them
Glyn has been a mover in the WFP scene, im not sure he has many new tricks up his sleeve, he might have, but some of the newer idea's are coming from the lads online who like to experiment with different things, you cannot use idea's from the DIY lot and then slag them off for building stuff for themselves
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Before we knock Omnipole and Glyn Howard maybe we should think about the good he has done for our industry. I know I would buy either tool from him again without hesitation.
to be fair Kev, i dont think any1 is knocking glyn ( omni )
he has made some statements in this thread that were just a little OTT, the thing about trolleys, backpacks, split chargers, baffled tanks, trolleys, backpacks, split chargers, baffled tanks, independant power supplies, Vikan brushes,
the nateral progression from a big van mount system for the bigger operators and the 1 man WC'er was allways going to be a trolley, of course that would need a independant power supply ( battery ) im not sure he can claim that as his idea
split chargers have been using in the caravan . motorhome for a very long time, i belive westefila installed a 2nd power source in the 70's
oh and Jeff B been using his backpack for a fair long time, i dont know if its longer than glyn has been usnign / selling them
Glyn has been a mover in the WFP scene, im not sure he has many new tricks up his sleeve, he might have, but some of the newer idea's are coming from the lads online who like to experiment with different things, you cannot use idea's from the DIY lot and then slag them off for building stuff for themselves
I agree with you Matt and you Mr H,
Inventions related to our industry will always benefit us the end user. Invented by a company like Omnipole or an inventor like Mr Jeff Brimble or a Problem solver and DiY enthusiast like Mr. H. If they took an invention and adapted for use or invented it from scratch it is irrelevant as long as it benefits our industry. I can understand Glyns reaction to some degree as the Omnivac is part of his living. He has spent valuable time and money developing it. Its a fantastic tool I can vouch for that. I can also understand why Mr H has built his own.
The experiment Mr H is doing with a Carbon fibre modular pole is very interesting. Will it last very long with nails, bits of roof tiles, grit and other assorted things found in gutters sucked through it? I for one am very interested to know. Also is it as effective with a standard 38 mm vac hose on it?, why did Glyn opt for a 50 mm hose and modify the vacuum to accept this larger hose? Im sure we will all find out soon thanks to Mr H and Glyn.
Forums are fantastic places to meet others and learn. But some times a bit of text taken out of context can lead to crucification as we all know.
I personally have enjoyed this debate but i must say that this forum would be better place for having both Mr H and Glyn in it especially as one of them would be able to answer my questions ;)
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If Glyn would have answered just a few simple questions directly and not the way a Politician does, then it would not have turned into a debate, no one knocked his product and I myself praised them, I have never used them but I did read up on the specs.
I have a lot of respect for the Guy but Glyn does not own the vacuum Industry but he chose to come on here and warn members about copyrights, he refused to answer what part was under his patent or even give the registered numbers, so we could check his copyright, even while a copyright is pending its still protected from the date it was registered, so no one could have pinched his copyright and I'm sure no one wants to.
No one as far as I knew wanted to copy his sytem directly or make it look like the omnivac one, all they wanted to do was build there own system, save money and work safely from the ground.
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i THINK that what he has done is known as "applied technology" by the patent office blokes and cannot be patented as it is simply an "application of existing technology for other purposes" so anyone can make their own system without worrying because all the gear to do it already exists
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i THINK that what he has done is known as "applied technology" by the patent office blokes and cannot be patented as it is simply an "application of existing technology for other purposes" so anyone can make their own system without worrying because all the gear to do it already exists
This is were Glyn got angry-ish, he did threaten possible legal retribution if anyone copied his ideas? and built a Vac system, so he was asked by a member for his registered patent number and he chose to ignored the question.
The problem with forums like this is that they are shared by suppliers and users alike which means that it can be difficult to critisize or debate different ideas or products without causing a storm.
I am very supprised at Glyn's attitude and seeming to delete his account in a huff. There are other suppliers who use this forum who take the critisism with good grace and refuse to get drawn into arguments. This obviously benefits them and us by acting proffessionally. I don't know Glyn or Omnipole but it has tainted my perception of his company and would make me think twice before using them. Maybe it's just me.
I agree with that Dave, the thing was no one critisize his products, they couldn't because he does sell good stuff.
They just argued about his claims to have copyright to the Vacuum system its even on his web-site with patent pending on it.
I must admit I was also very supprised at Glyn deleting his account. shame really.
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Oops was going to correct my spellings and deleted my post doh!
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Oops was going to correct my spellings and deleted my post doh!
Ha Ha! how many have you had tonight???? ;D ;D ;D
Good Job I quoted you? or they would have thought I was talking to myself again ;D ;D
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Where can I see this gutter vaccum systems?
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Where can I see this gutter vaccum systems?
http://www.omnipole.com/
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What I want to know is, how can you modify the standard vac to accept 51mm bore hose?
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What I want to know is, how can you modify the standard vac to accept 51mm bore hose?
Of course you can with a little engineering, but I thought this was best left to Omnivac ;D
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Where can I see this gutter vaccum systems?
Wow a new member appears on the same day that Glyn omnipole deleted his account and asks where to find the gutter system.
Uncanny that is.
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What I want to know is, how can you modify the standard vac to accept 51mm bore hose?
Of course you can with a little engineering, but I thought this was best left to Omnivac ;D
Yea, but would it just be a question of an attachment adaptor?
Also, the cheapest vac on Gardiners, has a Dry: 38 litres / Wet: 26 litres capacity. Would that be enough on your normal Domestic customers?
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Also, the cheapest vac on Gardiners, has a Dry: 38 litres / Wet: 26 litres capacity. Would that be enough on your normal Domestic customers?
surely you just empty it when its full ???
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It depends on how full the gutters are.
A customer who lives near a lot of trees and hasn't had them emptied for many years will probably need the 515 emptied once on the way round. Just empty it onto the compost heap or under a bush as most of what you take out will be just leaf debris and moss....
But to have a complete gutter cleaning system to do standard height houses for around the £500 mark..... I'm sure having the possability of emptying it once or even twice is a very minor inconvienience......
Regards
Mr H
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It depends on how full the gutters are.
A customer who lives near a lot of trees and hasn't had them emptied for many years will probably need the 515 emptied once on the way round. Just empty it onto the compost heap or under a bush as most of what you take out will be just leaf debris and moss....
But to have a complete gutter cleaning system to do standard height houses for around the £500 mark..... I'm sure having the possability of emptying it once or even twice is a very minor inconvienience......
Regards
Mr H
Absolutely, do you know how to modify the vac to take 51mm hose?
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No.... But then I have no need to as I use SL2 poles which are slightly smaller than 52mm anyway. It should be easy to do but I will have a look tomorrow.
Might just be a case of putting a larger inlet fitting on to the vacuum itself.
Regards
MR H
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Hi Mr H
Thanks for replying to my post, just to confirm! are you using a 38mm hose or 51mm hose!
Andy
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Hi Mr H
Thanks for replying to my post, just to confirm! are you using a 38mm hose or 51mm hose!
Andy
I use 8meters of 38mm from vacuum to pole and 1M of 52mm for the "U" shape section at the top. The SL2 has an internal diameter of 45mm.
To change the Vacuum from 38mm to 52mm would just be a case of unscrewing the 4 screws of the inlet connector, make the inlet hole slightly larger (very easy as its thin metal) and then replacing the inlet connector with a 52mm one.
I'm sure if you spoke to an industrial vacuum supplier they may be able to source the 52mm inlets for you.
Regards
Mr H
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Aaah, very nice. I'm definitely going to do that then.
Any idea what's up with the price of the hose on Gardiners website? 10meter is £76! :o ???
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Aaah, very nice. I'm definitely going to do that then.
Any idea what's up with the price of the hose on Gardiners website? 10meter is £76! :o ???
Thats not a bad price m8... It only works out at £6 + vat per meter
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Old Master wrote
Standard ISSA 515M 1 x1200 watt motor 38mm outlet £195.00
Standard ISSA 640M 3 x1200 watt motors 38mm outlet £457.00
10metres 38mm black hose our price £39.00
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Old Master wroteStandard ISSA 515M 1 x1200 watt motor 38mm outlet £195.00
Standard ISSA 640M 3 x1200 watt motors 38mm outlet £457.00
10metres 38mm black hose our price £39.00
That is an even better price, but check quality as some 38mm hose can be over £11 per meter.
Regards
Mr H
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oldmaster
10metres 38mm black hose our price £39.00 List price £ £55.40
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Here you go... (fill your boots)
I have spent months looking and you are not going to get any cheaper ;)
Here is a 3000w wet and dry industrial vacuum cleaner I have just order one 8)
Andy
http://www.easterntrading.co.uk/shop/shop.php?action=full&id=5&PHPSESSID=ad49f66552c65afd28d292a1996977e1
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is it from china?
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Here you go... (fill your boots)
I have spent months looking and you are not going to get any cheaper ;)
Here is a 3000w wet and dry industrial vacuum cleaner I have just order one 8)
Andy
http://www.easterntrading.co.uk/shop/shop.php?action=full&id=5&PHPSESSID=ad49f66552c65afd28d292a1996977e1
Andy Let us know how you get on with it? thanks for the link. ;)
is it from china?
Eastern Trading & Supply Limited
Progress Business Centre
Brookfield Drive
Cannock
Staffordshire
WS11 0JR
Email: sales@easterntrading.co.uk
Tel: 05601 165965
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Here you go... (fill your boots)
I have spent months looking and you are not going to get any cheaper ;)
Here is a 3000w wet and dry industrial vacuum cleaner I have just order one 8)
Andy
http://www.easterntrading.co.uk/shop/shop.php?action=full&id=5&PHPSESSID=ad49f66552c65afd28d292a1996977e1
Wow, that looks fantastic. Reaaally good price. Hope it will do the job though. :)
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andy you will have to let us know how you get on with this wet & dry have you used it yet ? marc
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andy you will have to let us know how you get on with this wet & dry have you used it yet ? marc
Waiting on a back order ::) seems they are very popular vacuum cleaners what with them being so cheap
The other problem that still needs to be resolved! I don't wont to spend 5 or 6 hundred pounds on a SL pole! and the hose problems! and still need to join it all together! it could take months to resolve!
Andy
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andy you will have to let us know how you get on with this wet & dry have you used it yet ? marc
The other problem that still needs to be resolved! I don't wont to spend 5 or 6 hundred pounds on a SL pole! and the hose problems! and still need to join it all together! it could take months to resolve!
Andy
You don't need to spend £500 or £600 on a gardiners pole.... Just buy the number of base sections that you need as you need them.
4 will get you just over 20ft which is enough for the average height house.
What do you mean by "hose problems".....?
regards
Mr H
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You don't need to spend £500 or £600 on a gardiners pole.... Just buy the number of base sections that you need as you need them.
How much does the base section cost?
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Poleman, why don't you just use some more tubing, and use your existing wfp, run the hose on the outside. That could do well enough on Domestic I suppose. I'm going that route.
Mr. H, what do you think?
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andy you will have to let us know how you get on with this wet & dry have you used it yet ? marc
The other problem that still needs to be resolved! I don't wont to spend 5 or 6 hundred pounds on a SL pole! and the hose problems! and still need to join it all together! it could take months to resolve!
Andy
You don't need to spend £500 or £600 on a gardiners pole.... Just buy the number of base sections that you need as you need them.
4 will get you just over 20ft which is enough for the average height house.
What do you mean by "hose problems".....?
regards
Mr H
Jeff I am sure can advice on this one! what about fishing poles! they would be a hell off alot cheaper
The problem about the hose! fitting a 51mm hose to a 38mm inlet in the vaccum cleaner
Andy
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Why not just stick with the 38mm hose that comes with the vacuum and see how it goes....?
Regards
Mr H
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I've just had come in stock two types of adapters - one allows a 38 mm hose to screw in one side and a 51 mm hose to screw in the other. The other fitting is a 51 mm hose cuff. This screws onto the end of 51 mm hose and provides a rubber nozzle. Perhaps this could be used on the end of your gutter vacuum instead of just bare hose or conceivably it would push fit into the outlet on the vacuum. I might send it to you Mr H so you can try it out :)
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Alex to the rescue. ;)
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I've just had come in stock two types of adapters - one allows a 38 mm hose to screw in one side and a 51 mm hose to screw in the other. The other fitting is a 51 mm hose cuff. This screws onto the end of 51 mm hose and provides a rubber nozzle. Perhaps this could be used on the end of your gutter vacuum instead of just bare hose or conceivably it would push fit into the outlet on the vacuum. I might send it to you Mr H so you can try it out :)
Thanks Alex....
I look forward to testing it out.....
Do you think the 51mm hose cuff would work as a better way of connecting the "U" section to the SL2...?
Regards
Mr H
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No, I don't think it will be a better way of connecting. Anyway, you can have a play with them.
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Just buy the number of base sections that you need as you need them.
Alex, whats your price for base sections of you SL
Andy
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Just buy the number of base sections that you need as you need them.
Alex, whats your price for base sections of you SL
Andy
£52 + vat each....
http://www.gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/acatalog/SUPER-LITE_2__DIY_KIT.html
Regards
Mr H
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Hmm, really wondering how a cheap x-tel would do. They are a bit whippy perhaps, I know SL will be excellent, but it would be £200 less with an existing pole you know. :)
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Poleman, why don't you just use some more tubing, and use your existing wfp, run the hose on the outside. That could do well enough on Domestic I suppose. I'm going that route.
Mr. H, what do you think?
The problem with doing that would be the weight at the top. You would have to use a much larger pole and remove the top sections or it would either snap or would be very wippy. It would also be dificult to connect a "U" section to the top.
Just weigh your own home vacuum tube and multiply it up. Now work out how high you want to go and then add in the weight of the pole, remembering that you are using the bottom sections only and so not having the narrower and lighter top sections. The SL2 at 60ft being used as a gutter vacuum weighs in at UNDER 4Kg complete.
For standard houses 3 x SL2 base sections are just over 15ft in actual length so provided you can reach up 3ft from the ground (i.e hip height) it should be about right.
Regards
Mr H
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but joe, its a vaccum attached to a hose to a length of pipe
will "hoover" be onto dyson for using the idea of a vaccum cleaner to suck up dirt
i cannot see it really and as its been said above, just looks like glyn is trying to " flex some muscle" and scare a few on a forum into not building a gutter vaccum cleaner :( a bit sad really
Hoovers patent ran out many years ago that is why Dysons and others are on the market now. You have protection for I think 20 years to give you time to gain a foothold in the market and establish your business. That is why a Dyson is called a hoover.
Dyson have many Patents on their machines, but none of them are for sucking dirt, unless it is for sucking dirt more effectively.
Peter
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but joe, its a vaccum attached to a hose to a length of pipe
will "hoover" be onto dyson for using the idea of a vaccum cleaner to suck up dirt
i cannot see it really and as its been said above, just looks like glyn is trying to " flex some muscle" and scare a few on a forum into not building a gutter vaccum cleaner :( a bit sad really
Hoovers patent ran out many years ago that is why Dysons and others are on the market now. You have protection for I think 20 years to give you time to gain a foothold in the market and establish your business. That is why a Dyson is called a hoover.
Dyson have many Patents on their machines, but none of them are for sucking dirt, unless it is for sucking dirt more effectively.
Peter
well you learn something new everyday ;)
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I've only just seen this one. Looks like a brilliant idea. From what I see it is different to omnipoles idea in that you suck through the pole and not a hose running the length of the pole. That from what i see is an original idea. Saves on the weight making a lot lighter than the omnipole I imagine.
Maybe the part that Glynn was worried about was the attatchment at the top as that does look very similar.
Regarding the the blockage in the narrow hose before the vac why not develop a small trap box before the inlet. In fact if it didn't take away from the overall suction which if the seals are good I don't think it would, it could increase the capacity of the vac.
Again a great idea.
Simon.
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Their units do suck through the pole
www.omni-guttervac.com (http://www.omni-guttervac.com)
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Thats an interesting website ! - never seen it before.
I thought the omni was outside the pole. But now realise that from one of the pics under "gutter vac system" That one version at least is through the alu pole, so the pole dia. looks to be about 2" to match the larger 510mm new hose.
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unsure about the system from omnipole mysen too!!
I currentley use a 30foot powerpole and was told that it could be adapted for gutterwork when purchasing it 18 month back.....maybe Glyn could enlighten us??
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I found the " power pole " I hired too whippy, even when the pressure was throttled back. Also 30ft aint quite high enough for my area.
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I found the " power pole " I hired too whippy, even when the pressure was throttled back. Also 30ft aint quite high enough for my area.
Jeff using a pressure washer over about 30ft requires a support pole. We use Omnipoles powerpole and pressure wash up to 48ft with no problems, but it is a two man operation over 30ft.
Thats an interesting website ! - never seen it before.
I thought the omni was outside the pole. But now realise that from one of the pics under "gutter vac system" That one version at least is through the alu pole, so the pole dia. looks to be about 2" to match the larger 510mm new hose.
The pictures on the far right and left are pictures of me ;).
The new pole used for the omnivac is about 50mm and is made from aluminum it is semi- telescopic. The vacuum is inside this tube. We find the 38mm attachment for gutters blocks too often so we prefer the quicker and thicker 50mm tool extension, however the omnivac is supplied with both tools. (we use the 38mm tool only in really narrow gutters (once in a blue moon).
Hope this helps
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Kev, thanks it does help.
Could you/someone explain "semi telescopic" -is it only the bottom one ?
Whats the weight/length of each section ?
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Kev, thanks it does help.
Could you/someone explain "semi telescopic" -is it only the bottom one ?
Whats the weight/length of each section ?
Hi Jeff, each section is made up of two sections of aluminum tube, an inner tube and an outer tube that slide together one inside the other. You just add one two section piece to the other to get the length you want. If you see what I mean. The vac hose connects to the bigger tube and the section with the attachments is very slightly narrower. you just add a inside tube outside tube inside tube until you get the length you require. Each section is about 6ft. Im not sure of the weight but at 48ft its no problem. This is as high as I have attempted.
I personally find it easier to put the pole together on the ground then lift it into position, if its too short or too long I adjust it on the nearest telescopic section while its in position.
;)Kev
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OK so they are parallel modulars that slide inside each other :)
Just printed off the adobe pics on the website -very good clarity.
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You said it better than I could Jeff.. LOL ;D
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Good news!
My order for this Vacuum Cleaner should be with me today, its ex demo, so got a big discount, down side if you wont to order one, the new stock wont be in for 6 or 7 weeks, but I am sure you can pre order or put your name down
http://www.easterntrading.co.uk/shop/shop.php?action=full&id=5&PHPSESSID=f0fb92898f669fcaeb55b0e3e92727f0
Phoned this company www.morclean.co.uk for 51mm hose and they have also been able to supply me with the 51mm inlet for the Vacuum Cleaner, so just need to cut a 51mm hole in the side
Cost so far is just over 200 pounds, just need to sort a vaccum pole, which I have been looking at 51mm (5 foot sections) rain down pipes!
Andy
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Excellent poleman. Sounds very good. Looking forward to it! :)
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Hows the new vacuum doing Poleman....?
Regards
Mr H
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Vacuum cleaner come in this week, But I didn't realize it was so big! I order 7meter 51mm hose when really should have got 15 meters to help with getting around houses with out moving the vacuum cleaner to much, but I will find out on the 1st job!
Next is to get up to the gutter! SL2 would do the job and its my last resort @ £335 I have been talking to someone I know how uses rain down pipe (51mm) which is very cheap £5 meter but in his words "its not the best" just email stream tonight as they do a lightweight aluminium pole http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-45-FT-LIGHTWEIGHT-ALUMINIUM-WATER-FED-POLE_W0QQitemZ230230418350QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item230230418350 and I might be able to buy sections! any way I will see what they have to say and go from there :)
Andy
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Has anyone considered a petrol alternative to the vac? Most of my custies are out when I clean,.. and a generator big enough to power a triple motor vac will be expensive, heavy, and take up a lot of space in my van!
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Remember that when using the SL2 its ONLY the bottom base sections that you need..... So if your not in thmarket for an actual wfp pole yet then just buy the number of section you need. 4 will cost £208 and get you up to 21 feet plus your reach of 3 - 4 feet.....
Regards
Mr H
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Could something like this be modified to suit:
http://www.mower-magic.co.uk/acatalog/Windy_Wheeled_Vacuum.html
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If you can get the equivalant of 3600watts of suction power from it then yes it could work, but it doesn't say what size pipeing it takes. needs to be 38mm minimum really. And that collection bag would get very messy if there was a lot of sludge and water to clean away.
Regards
Mr H
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Has anyone considered a petrol alternative to the vac? Most of my custies are out when I clean,.. and a generator big enough to power a triple motor vac will be expensive, heavy, and take up a lot of space in my van!
I will be asking the customers that are going to be out, to put an extension lead out of there letter box, and for back up will be buying this (Rated Power 3400W) which would easy cover my needs of 3000w http://www.generators.co.uk/briggsstratton/gens/proplus4500.php
Andy
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I just found this:
http://www.fresh-group.com/wheelie-bin-vac-range.htm
I've emailed asking prices and specs.
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No longer sold and not enough power Nat... Looks naff to....
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When I bought my omnivac, the salesman had one of these in the van. We gave it a go, it did work on lower gutters but was not powerful enough at height.
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cheers m8 will check it out
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I found this rather interesting......
http://www.google.co.uk/patents?id=ZPo7AAAAEBAJ
Filing date: 11 Feb 1974
Seems like the idea for gutter vacuuming have been around and even patented for ages.....
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diy gutter vacing, great idea, i already have an sl2 that you are supposed to use. Has anyone come up with a decent decal logo that we can use to show that we are pro?
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I'm working on a logo,..
"Reach & Vac"
:)
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I'm working on a logo,..
"Reach & Vac"
Ionics already protected that years ago
I will be asking the customers that are going to be out, to put an extension lead out of there letter box
To think you once had the biggest RO in the window cleaning industry, what was it Brodex charged you £15,000 for the RO or some such outrageous figure like that now your skimping on a few pounds.
Andy what went wrong?
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My health glyn! which I think you know!! work doesnt came high on my list any more, aim enjoying life!! as I found to my cost it can be very short!! this was me last weekend...
http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-snc1/v2590/65/45/669433427/n669433427_2338757_309608.jpg
http://photos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs034.snc1/2597_1114894954731_1297673654_30338582_5092042_n.jpg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3BNUpEZGS4
Andy
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Good on you Andy
Work to live mate
not live to work
Some postings on here are quite cutting
If we were all that perfect we would be bothered to post on forums. :P :P
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My health glyn! which I think you know!! work doesnt came high on my list any more, aim enjoying life!! as I found to my cost it can be very short!! this was me last weekend...
http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-snc1/v2590/65/45/669433427/n669433427_2338757_309608.jpg
http://photos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs034.snc1/2597_1114894954731_1297673654_30338582_5092042_n.jpg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3BNUpEZGS4
Andy
Andy
you have come along way ;)
i just remember the banter we used to have, me enjoying life and spending my money on that, seems only a few weeks ago
welcome to life outside work ;D ;D
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Lol I was waiting for you to pop up ;) yes all work and no play as they say!! :)
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My health glyn! which I think you know
Andy ..... Sorry I thought that had just been a scare.
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Fair play glyn :) its something I have to live with!
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My health glyn! which I think you know!! work doesnt came high on my list any more, aim enjoying life!! as I found to my cost it can be very short!! this was me last weekend...
http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-snc1/v2590/65/45/669433427/n669433427_2338757_309608.jpg
http://photos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs034.snc1/2597_1114894954731_1297673654_30338582_5092042_n.jpg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3BNUpEZGS4
Andy
Andy,
Do you go to the one on the isle of wight ?
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Hi Ian, yes a grow up as a teenager around scooters! I went to the IOW scooter rally back in 1984 and had they time of my life! the scooter scene is very friendly down to earth! I will be there is Aug bank hoilday :)
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I'm working on a logo,..
"Reach & Vac"
Ionics already protected that years ago
I will be asking the customers that are going to be out, to put an extension lead out of there letter box
To think you once had the biggest RO in the window cleaning industry, what was it Brodex charged you £15,000 for the RO or some such outrageous figure like that now your skimping on a few pounds.
Andy what went wrong?
"Stretch and Suck" then??
:)
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Lol I was waiting for you to pop up ;) yes all work and no play as they say!! :)
;D ;D ;D ;D
i never fail to disappoint ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Well it was a suggestion that wasn't really serious, a flame post i suppose, i guessed that glyn would read it and quietly fume, but i never thought he would post. I do have an sl2, but wouldn't know how to make it suck gutters. I suppose glyn has us back with all the new start up starters....But if you could ever get one of those hairdyers in polemans video to suck, instead of blow, you could both work and play.
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Time to resurrect this thread perhaps? :)
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I found this rather interesting......
http://www.google.co.uk/patents?id=ZPo7AAAAEBAJ
Filing date: 11 Feb 1974
Seems like the idea for gutter vacuuming have been around and even patented for ages.....
;D
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Time to resurrect this thread perhaps? :)
Why....?
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Some minor up to date details can be found on Topic:
http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=171795.new#new
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Pipe Clamps (Munsen rings) are available from:
http://www.dcssltd.co.uk/bracketry-clamps/pipe-clamps-support/pipe-clamps-rubber-lined/cat_85.html?added=1
Many thanks to Dave Willis for the link... :-)
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Are you still using SL2 base sections for your gutter vac poles Mr H?
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Still using the same ones..... Really lasting well.
I give them a good clean out after every use and spray with PTFE spray inside each pole and the joins about once a month.
Regards
Mr H
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still using mine too, must be about four years now at a guess. I remember people said they would wear out from the inside in five minutes - no wear at all.
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I think if somebody came up with a reach pole for sucking gutters id buy 1.
Brilliant idea
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Well thats prety much what the DIY system is Cliff. Some systems use regular telescopic poles and the suction hose is attached to the outside but that makes it very heavy so can't go as high as a suck through system.
Regards
Mr H
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This Topic Is FANTASTIC, what a brilliant guy mr H, a CREDIT to the industry.!
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fantastic, cant believe how cheap they are compared to suppliers, glad theres knowledgeable people like you in the game to help people out like this, what a fantastic idea,
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Interesting.
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Very